Which way forward for the tar sands?

Even if that were true what difference would it make? The argument that if you drive a car or use oil you can't be against the oil sands, or that your reasons can't be effective, is ridiculous.

If I argue against pedophilia and you find out later that I am a pedophile it would make me a hypocrite but it wouldn't negate my arguments against pedophilia or make pedophilia okay.

If, for the sake of argument, Unionist defended government intervention to save union jobs in the car industry, he still wouldn't be a hypocrite for condemning the oil sands. The oil sands are a particular target because the extraction method is far more energy intensive and environmentally damaging than acquiring oil from other sources where it is closer to the surface and not mixed with sand.

..txs unionist for the thread. we have come to a point where the crisis around us has become unbearable. austerity and extraction 2 heads of the same beast while climate is a 3rd. what a disaster. for now the expansion of the tar sands has been curtailed. not halted though i don't believe. the demonstration in toronto last weekend points to a growing resistance to any further expansion as well as austerity. at the same time presenting alternatives that deserve equal time as those solutions proposed by political parties..they are that compelling. we will see how that works out but for now pipelines are on very shaky grounds. we have that.

I never even mentioned Rachel Notley, the NDP, or the Liberals. Any premier of Alberta has to support the oilsands or they will be thrown out of office even with a majority. There would be riots if Notley said anything about ending the oilsands. It's the people that have to stop the oilsands and with a little help from the dive in oil prices people are doing a pretty good job.

One option would be to build a refinery in place or close by but those are very expensive, the time may be past for such things. Governments will not shut down the oilsands unless the people demand it and even then they might not unless physically stopped. It is a combination of the people and the marketplace that will determine the fate of the oilsands.

..the empire is crumbling under the weight of it's own rot. all they really have is the batton while going out in a fit of rage.

eta:

..i can't find the video any more because the the toronto march site has removed them from public access. but something that i think is extraordinary took place. a first peoples spokes woman offered up a new deal. we will continue to block the pipelines but in return you must support their struggle to end colonization.

Assembly of First Nations to host national energy forum in February

The future of Canada’s two largest pipeline projects hinges on the cooperation of First Nations throughout the country.

With billions of dollars and swaths of aboriginal territory at stake, the Assembly of First Nations will try to leverage their legal rights and force a negotiation with Canada’s energy producers and the federal government. AFN National Chief Perry Bellegarde said Tuesday he plans on hosting a national energy forum in February with the goal of getting big oil, Ottawa and First Nations at the table.

But some say the pipeline issue can’t wait until next year and that aboriginal chiefs have to unite and resist the expansion of Alberta oil sands development across Canada. The debate illustrates the complex relationship between the federal government, First Nations and natural resource exploitation....

quote:

In Kanesatake — a Quebec Mohawk community near Montreal — opposition to the Energy East project could also play itself out in the courts. The proposed pipeline would pass through the northern edge of the Mohawk settlement.

“We won’t roll over for anyone,” said Kanesatake Grand Chief Serge Simon. “Your pipeline violates my community’s laws and if you want to take me to court, go for it, the judge will get an earful. … We can’t stand alone, we’re forming an alliance with the (Quebec) Innu and communities in British Columbia. Let’s form a vice between east and west and let’s start squeezing them in.”

Simon has previously said his people will form barricades to prevent construction of the pipeline.

largest oil spill in history was found yesterday just south of Ft McMurray.