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A progressive Saudi Arabia?
September 29, 2016 - 10:45pm
*****
In Saudi Arabia, a revolution disguised as reform?
http://wpo.st/tp_12
Also
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/09/saudi-arabia-terrorism-fu...
If they start being nice to the Houthis I might forgo some of my scepticism.
I was surprised yesterday to see they have more women in their parliament than Japan.
Checking the numbers, I was even more surprised to see they have slightly more (19.7 percent to 19.4) women in their parliament than the United States, and far more than some other places I will not mention because of sensitive ears.
(if I can use the Donald Trump method of letting you know exactly what I am talking about)
Still. Let them stop cutting off people's heads and lashing people for blogging. Then we can talk.
http://www.ipu.org/WMN-e/classif.htm
Only two countries have more women than men in parliament. Neither is in the so-called developed world.
They let more women in a parliament that has no powers since Saudi Arabia is an absolute theocratic monarchy. The people of Saudi Arabia are truly lucky to have the right kind of despots ruling over them. As long as the Sheiks remain loyal allies of the West the normal people will not be subjected to a regime change civil war. Its a good thing they are not a secular regime like Iraq or Libya or Syria because then the West would have a Responsibility to Protect their people from their dictator. Destroying all the infrasrtructure of the country would of course be an unfortunante side effect of the R2P mission.
US-Armed Saudi Coalition Bombed Yemen Funeral, Massacring 140, Wounding 525 in 'Lake of Blood'
http://www.salon.com/2016/10/08/u-s-armed-saudi-coalition-bombed-yemen-f...
And after the jets first strike on the mourners, they returned to 'double-tap' the responders a couple more times. Just watch the same local liberal imperialists who support the White Helmets of Al Qaeda condemn this latest Saudi massacre in Yemen even though the same players are responsible for the nightmare in Syria. And even as Kiev does to Donbass what western propaganda accuses Russia/Damascus of doing to Aleppo. Israel, America and Saudi power means mass murder with impunity. And Canada always goes along with the ride.
Doug Woodard, I always appreciate your posts here, but not this time. Both your links are from participants in some recent delegation run by the Washington Institute for Near East Policy. Both of them repeat exactly the same script. Neither of them actually reports any, like, progressive move taken by Saudi (and no, I'm not impressed by the number of women in a phony body, where they'd have to be driven to work with their husbands' permission).
Both articles heavily lean toward, "let's ramp up our aid and alliance" - because Saudi will be an increasing bulwark against the real enemy (Iran) and the "terrorists" (Hezbollah). And no mention of Yemen, of course.
So if you want to understand why this scripted whitewash job suddenly appeared under the signatures of two different authors, you might want to recall this Huff Post piece by M.J. Rosenberg:
Does PBS Know That “The Washington Institute” Was Founded By AIPAC?
So... please.
I don't know where or whether this was reported, but I only learned about this today:
Last May, the U.S. House and Senate unanimously passed a measure allowing families of 9/11 victims to sue Saudi Arabia (15 of the 19 hijackers were Saudi citizens).
On September 23, Obama vetoed that measure.
On September 30, the House and Senate voted overwhelmingly to over-ride his veto - for the first time since he became president.
Here was the White House's bizarre reaction:
Read all about it here:
Congress overrides Obama's veto of 9/11 bill letting families sue Saudi Arabia
"Progressive" Saudi Arabia slaughters more Yemeni civilians:
Yemen conflict: Dozens killed as air strikes hit prison in Hudaydah
UNHRC Vote On Russia Out, Saudi Arabia In - 'Shocking and Shameful'
http://on.rt.com/7tds
"According to Daoud Khairallah, International Law professor at Georgetown University, ' it is absolutely shocking...It absolutely defies any logic that a country like Saudi Arabia- with a consistent record of violating international law, any kind of civil law inside the kingdom and beyond, a promoter of terrorism,' - is being re-elected a member of the human rights body, said Khairallah..."
Canada was an active instigator/promoter.
Saudi Arabia is our friend. They don't challenge US supremacy. Russia does. It's really not that hard to understand.
Oh, you thought the UNHRC had anything to do with Human Rights?
It's just like when the US overthrows hostile dictators in the name of "spreading democracy." But, then, in other countries, oberthrows democratically elected socialist/communist leaders and replaces them with friendly capitalist dictators in the name of "human rights." It's all just smokescreens to reward loyal friends and punish those who step out of line.
(I know you get it NDPP. My reply is aimed at the faux surprise "defies any logic" in the article you linked.)
It remains scandalous that Saudi Arabia has membership on the Human Rights Council. This is alrgely because the Asian states get together in advance and agree on a slate - so in effect, Saudi Arabia ran un-opposed. Although it seems there were some write-in votes from countries unwilling to vote the straight Asian bloc slate.
There were two countries in Eastern Europe willing to run against Russia - and both proved more popular. It's much like the year when the USA lost its seat on the Human Rights committee when George W. Bush was president. Americans were outraged. But this is what happens in a contested election - the country that's less popular with the UN membership tend to lose.
Full voting results
I think what's really needed, as groups like Human Rights Watch argue, is for minimum standards of human rights respect to be barred from the Council. Saudi Arabia should be barred, I think. Russia should not - but all countries should accept that they might lose an election, none of them(including the USA and Russia) have an automatic right to be elected.
I don't think that's a good idea. It's bad enough (even though I understand the historical and pragmatic reasons) that some states have a birthright on the "Security" Council. Just try writing down your "minimum standards" and see how far you get. I'm not the least bit disturbed by Saudi Arabia being on this human rights council. If you bar them, you'd have to bar their suppliers and customers too, no? Want a list?
It's the United Nations. Not the Nations We LIke.
ETA: I'll tell you what does bother me. Unions and political parties thinking it's ok to sell weapons of death to the Saudis. And babblers, who should know better, innocently citing AIPAC-sponsored ass-lickers of Israel as "experts" about how Saudi Arabia is becoming more progressive. We should cure the illness in our country, and in the progressive movement, before being "scandalized" about what the U.N. is doing.
A Russian view:
Saudi Arabia, good. Russia, bad. Four legs good, two legs bad.
UNHRC vote on Russia out, Saudi Arabia in — ‘shocking and shameful’
‘Saudi Arabia one of top repressive countries’: What’s behind US special ties with Riyadh?
Poor Canada! Only 10 billion or so in sales. But then such sales help to pervert the Canadian labour movement. And that's worth it's weight in... gold. [rolleyes]
RT/Chris Hedges: "Let's talk about this special relationship with Saudi Arabia, especially in light of the fact, as you point out in the book, the US now takes only 13 percent of Saudi oil…"
It's shocking and shameful, sure - but again, only because there was no Asian ountry willing to run against the Asian slate, so Saudi Arabia ran un-opposed. But for the eastern Eoropean spots, there was an open contest, and Hungary and Croatia got more votes than Russia.
Saudi Arabia and Russia were not running against each other for a seat, a fact overlooked in 90% of the Western and pro-Krelmin press.
Just a short factual comment, since we are in the midst of a spin cycle of outrage.
Is Saudi Arabia on the cusp of change?
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-38951539
For many years there has been informed speculation that Saudi Arabia, lacking reform, was headed for a blowup. I judge it will remain an issue for many years more.
Lucky for the Monarchy that countries like Canada are willing to sell them urban warfare machines to use against any real dissent.
Revolutions usually happen when the soldiers and police become unwilling to defend the old regime. "Urban warfare machines" may not make a great deal of difference.
So are you supporting the sale of these small tanks because you don't think they are effective or merely engaging in wishful thinking.
I don't like the fact that we sell arms to Saudi Arabia, but I don't think it's highly significant. I think that moves toward internal reform in Saudi Arabia are very significant indeed, and I hope they succeed. I wonder somewhat why you seem to want to draw a red herring across this issue and talk about something else.
I have no objection to a reformed, preferably constitutional monarchy in a Saudi Arabia undergoing a process of evolutionary change. I don't want to see a political explosion in SA with a likelihood of civil war, foreign intervention, and quite possibly a wider war involving Iran, the U.S. (which might try to drag NATO in) and Russia.