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Vimy Park in Outremont to be renamed Jacques Parizeau Park

Unionist
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Unionist
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Montreal's Outremont borough moves to rename Vimy Park after Jacques Parizeau

Quote:

A move by the Montreal borough of Outremont to change the name of one of its neighbourhood parks from Vimy Park to Jacques-Parizeau Park is stirring controversy.

The borough received permission from the City of Montreal's executive committee Wednesday to change the park's name to honour former Quebec premier Jacques Parizeau, who died last year.

Parizeau had lived for years on a street adjoining the small park.

Montreal's municipal council is expected to vote on the name change at its meeting on June 20.

But Jeremy Diamond is among those saying the name Vimy should stay.

"I think it's disappointing and I think it is misguided," said Diamond, executive director of The Vimy Foundation, a Canadian charity group that promotes the legacy of the First World War.

French Quebecers are being presented (accurately) as having hated World War I, which they saw (accurately) as Canada simply following Britain into some colonial battle, costing more Canadian lives than World War II did. Quebecers rose up against conscription and several gave their lives in that struggle.

The other side of the MSM coin is that "Canadians" are being presented as in love with the "legacy" of WWI, with the mass slaughter of Vimy being the defining moment that somehow created Canada as a unified nation.

Yes, many people are the victims of propaganda, and we can't really blame them for that. But if there were ever a referendum question: "Should we rename Vimy Park and leave Canada, or keep the name and stay in Canada?" - I know how I'd vote.


Mr. Magoo
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Joined: Dec 13 2002

Quote:
"I think what we risk doing when we replace events that have happened 100 years ago, or 500 years ago or 1,000 years ago, we risk erasing them from our memory altogether."

He thinks Parizeau should be honoured in another way.

"Is there another park? Is there a roadway? Is there a town square?"

Well, first of all our primary means of remembering and teaching history probably shouldn't be through the naming of small municipal parks.  Or else where is "Japanese Internment Park"?

Second, buddy will be pleased to know that the nation of France has named an entire TOWN after Vimy.  And joking aside, it's home to Canada's largest war monument.  I doubt we'll forget.


Unionist
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Thanks for that, Magoo - I concur.

But there's a big question here. When and how are we going to deal with the glorification of World War I? It never ends. In Québec, it has no legs. But what does the "rest of Canada" really know or understand about what happened there and why? I'm not suggesting that Quebecers have figured it out. But we all need to.

 


Misfit
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So you think that some racist French politician should be honoured with a park in his name who insulted immigrants? Didn't he say that he lost the referendum due to money and the ethnic vote? I have no problem with French politicians being recognized for their contributions to society, but blatently racist ones...no. And in a multicultural community...no. I think there are better leaders who deserve better recognition than him. IMO.

bagkitty
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When are they putting out a call for bids for a new monument to be placed in the park? I have plans for a giant stainless steel box of tissues - the working title is "Money and the Ethnic Vote".

On a slightly more serious note, I too am tired of whoever is responsible trying to slap a commemorative label glorifying militarism on every park and natural feature in the country. Then again, a few signs and a little bit of paint are a LOT cheaper than actually paying on promises made to veterans.


Left Turn
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I'm not a fan of naming the park after either Vimy or Jaques Parizeau. I wish they would find a name that is neither a First World War battle or a former racist politician.


Mr. Magoo
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"Capitalism Park"

See-saw: 50 cents.


Unionist
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"Racist". You know nothing about Parizeau. You are the poster children for why someday Québec may declare its independence. What a shameful display.

 


Unionist
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Misfit wrote:
I have no problem with French politicians being recognized for their contributions to society,

He's not "French". Are you serious??

Quote:
... but blatently racist ones...no. And in a multicultural community...no. I think there are better leaders who deserve better recognition than him. IMO.

Two ignorant comments. Absolutely amazing. You believe everything you read in MSM headlines? Have you ever considered doing your own investigation?

 


Misfit
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They are not ignorant comments. Your ignorant opinion. Left Turn nailed it, IMO.

Mr. Magoo
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"Jane Goodall Park"

Please don't call them "monkey bars".


Unionist
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Both of your comments are ignorant - copycat comments from the MSM, without any investigation whatsoever. Shame.

Jacques Parizeau, former PQ premier, slams charter of values

Get back to me when (and if) you've looked into this.

ETA: By the way, did you get that Parizeau was not a "French politician" - or do you need that racist comment further deconstructed??


Misfit
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Not everybody agrees with you, Unionist. Now give it up.

Unionist
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You call someone "racist", you have a responsibility to justify that. I really don't respect your "opinion" without a little bit of, like, evidence. If your entire proof is based on a comment he made on referendum night, which he explained later - then you really haven't got the foggiest clue. Don't go name-calling a progressive political figure who helped bring way more progressive measures to Québec than the rest of Canada has managed to swallow to this day.


Misfit
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Jane Goodall park sounds great. However I think she was into chimpanzees, not monkeys. Gee, mYbe I can be called a racist for that one too.

Unionist
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Have you looked into the article I linked, and other resources as to what Jacques Parizeau said and meant and fought for? Or do you just feel comfortable calling someone a "racist" because it tickles your fancy? 


Mr. Magoo
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Quote:
Jane Goodall park sounds great. However I think she was into chimpanzees, not monkeys. Gee, mYbe I can be called a racist for that one too.

Exactly.  Chimps aren't monkeys, so ... Please don't call them "monkey bars".  That was the (failed?) joke.


6079_Smith_W
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Misfit wrote:
So you think that some racist French politician should be honoured with a park in his name who insulted immigrants?

Oh for heaven's sake. Maybe we should start with all the "Churchill"s and "Macdonalds" in Canada. And every "Garnet" and "Wolseley".

Then work our way down to the "McClungs" and "Douglas"s until we just give everything a number.


jjuares
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I listened to Parizeau's explanation for his ethnic votes comment. I was totally underwhelmed by his justification. Indeed he seemed to be doubling down on it, pointing out that polls were overwhelming ' No' in some areas. So what? Here is a thought experiment. What if he determined that gay voters had voted no. Would it be alright if he had said that they were defeated by " gays". Sorry, a vote is a vote and I place no premium on certain voters nor do I discount other voters. It is undemocratic to do so. He may have done many good things but this comment is inappropriate.

Left Turn
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Unionist wrote:

"Racist". You know nothing about Parizeau. You are the poster children for why someday Québec may declare its independence. What a shameful display.

Ok, we can debate whether Parizeau's "money and the ethnic vote" comment was racist. I would contend that he was referring not only to white anglos, but also to poc immigrants, arguing that if we hadn't allowed them to come to Quebec the referendum would have passed. If he was only referring to white anglos, it may not be the racist comment I thought it was.

Regardless, I think that Pareizeau's "money and the ethnic vote" comment was in poor taste, and that he is therefore undeserving of having anything named after him.


Misfit
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I agree with jjuares and Left Turn. If I was a POC living in Outremont, I know that I would be offended. And yes, I think we need to examine the Nelly McClungs, the Tommy Douglas's, the Sir John A MacDonald's, etc., and look into their racist pasts. There are some who do, IMO, deserve to have their statues removed and honours taken away.

Misfit
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Duncan Campbell Scott is one Canadian who I feel does deserve to have all honorariums removed.

Badriya
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Misfit wrote:
Not everybody agrees with you, Unionist. Now give it up.

I am not a big fan of Monsieur Parizeau, but let's look at the facts.  He was an economist during the Quiet Revolution and was responsible for nationalizing Hydro Quebec and establishing the QPP.  He was finance minister in René Lévesque's and a long-serving premier ministre of Québec.  it is true he made a deplorable comment after losing the referendum, but he made a positive contribution to Québec society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_ParizeauAnd if you don't like parks and buildings named after racists, look 

 


Badriya
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Misfit wrote:
Not everybody agrees with you, Unionist. Now give it up.

I am not a big fan of Monsieur Parizeau, but let's look at the facts.  He was an economist during the Quiet Revolution and was responsible for nationalizing Hydro Quebec and establishing the QPP.  He was finance minister in René Lévesque's and a long-serving premier ministre of Québec.  it is true he made a deplorable comment after losing the referendum, but he made a positive contribution to Québec society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_ParizeauAnd if you don't like parks and buildings named after racists, look 

 


Badriya
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Misfit wrote:
Not everybody agrees with you, Unionist. Now give it up.

I am not a big fan of Monsieur Parizeau, but let's look at the facts.  He was an economist during the Quiet Revolution and was responsible for nationalizing Hydro Quebec and establishing the QPP.  He was finance minister in René Lévesque's and a long-serving premier ministre of Québec.  it is true he made a deplorable comment after losing the referendum, but he made a positive contribution to Québec society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_ParizeauAnd if you don't like parks and buildings named after racists, look 

 


Badriya
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Joined: Aug 1 2014

Misfit wrote:
Not everybody agrees with you, Unionist. Now give it up.

I am not a big fan of Monsieur Parizeau, but let's look at the facts.  He was an economist during the Quiet Revolution and was responsible for nationalizing Hydro Quebec and establishing the QPP.  He was finance minister in René Lévesque's and a long-serving premier ministre of Québec.  it is true he made a deplorable comment after losing the referendum, but he made a positive contribution to Québec society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Parizeau

 


Badriya
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Joined: Aug 1 2014

Misfit wrote:
Not everybody agrees with you, Unionist. Now give it up.

I am not a big fan of Monsieur Parizeau, but let's look at the facts.  He was an economist during the Quiet Revolution and was responsible for nationalizing Hydro Quebec and establishing the QPP.  He was finance minister in René Lévesque's and a long-serving premier ministre of Québec.  it is true he made a deplorable comment after losing the referendum, but he made a positive contribution to Québec society.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacques_Parizeau

 


lagatta
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"Ethnic votes" referred to a coalition of "ethnic élite" organizations supposedly representing the Italian, Jewish and Greek communities. Those organizations were and remain deeply undemocratic. I know the leftist Italo-Québécois who fought the Congresso, and we all know how any progressive Jewish people who were the slightest opposed to Israel's oppression of the Palestinian people were shut out of the Jewish Federation, which has re-emerged as a voice for "Israeli and Jewish" interests. There were similar challenges to the Greek organization.

"Money" referred to money flooding in illegally from the RoC to the No side. Some have insinuated that it was an anti-semitic dog whistle, but there was no evidence of this.

Parizeau was despressed and had more than a few wee drams in his throat at the time, and was made to step down from everything after the comment.

Alexandre Boulerice also caught flak for stating the obvious, that the "Great War" was crowned heads and capitlaists sending the sons of workers and farmers to massacre each other. Jean Jaurès and Rosa Luxemburg said the same, at a very sad socialist meeting against the war just before the guns of August. Both of them were murdered by militarists.


6079_Smith_W
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Misfit wrote:
Duncan Campbell Scott is one Canadian who I feel does deserve to have all honorariums removed.

I think this is just fine. It is good to not forget:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/duncan-campbell-scott-plaque-update...

How is he any worse than the man on our 10 dollar  bill? Or the hundred? After all, Borden was PM when the government learned that the death rates in some of those institutions was 70 percent, and he did nothing.

And what are they going to do, chisel out the edifice of the Thomas Scott Memorial Hall in Winnipeg?

That is why this flap over Parizeau is ridiculous. I don't downplay what he said, but it isn't imposing the War Measures Act. He made an important contribution, and he deserves the honour.


Unionist
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lagatta wrote:

"Ethnic votes" referred to a coalition of "ethnic élite" organizations supposedly representing the Italian, Jewish and Greek communities. Those organizations were and remain deeply undemocratic. I know the leftist Italo-Québécois who fought the Congresso, and we all know how any progressive Jewish people who were the slightest opposed to Israel's oppression of the Palestinian people were shut out of the Jewish Federation, which has re-emerged as a voice for "Israeli and Jewish" interests. There were similar challenges to the Greek organization.

"Money" referred to money flooding in illegally from the RoC to the No side. Some have insinuated that it was an anti-semitic dog whistle, but there was no evidence of this.

Parizeau was despressed and had more than a few wee drams in his throat at the time, and was made to step down from everything after the comment.

Alexandre Boulerice also caught flak for stating the obvious, that the "Great War" was crowned heads and capitlaists sending the sons of workers and farmers to massacre each other. Jean Jaurès and Rosa Luxemburg said the same, at a very sad socialist meeting against the war just before the guns of August. Both of them were murdered by militarists.

Thanks for setting the record straight, lagatta! And you might have added that Parizeau publicly told the PQ to drop their "Charter of Values" - which he said was really just an attack on female Muslims.


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